The K Report

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Kith, Apr 12, 2012.

  1. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    This is where I post class reviews.

    First up we have the Operations Commando because I'm tired of hearing people complain about it.

    Yes, Kithrixx is doing podcasts now. I'm going to say lots of bad words, so brace yourself.
  2. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Though I'm surprised people complain about the OpsComm.
  3. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Liaison

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Bugs, Pugs, and Scruggs

    Be warned, there is nudity!
  4. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    "KITH UR STAF NOW PLS NERF OPSMANDO"

    I get this all. The fucking. Time.
  5. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Liaison

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Bugs, Pugs, and Scruggs

    [sarcasm]Yes, please nerf the most synergistic and arguably best designed class in the game.[/sarcasm]
  6. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Heh.

    Well the Old Man, Peasant Logic I tend to use and apply says that SOMETHING is going to be the King of DPS, unless we downgrade all the way to a game like Checkers or something. And whatever the current King is, people are going to rally for or against. No one gives a shit about second or third. Who here can name anyone who won a Bronze Medal in Beijing's Olympic games? Particularly if they came in behind relative stars like Michael Phelps or Usain Bolt?

    So obviously there is going to be a King. Obviously the King will have split appeal. The only real solutions are Status Quo, Diversification, or Name a New King, either by tearing him down or making the problem worse by creating a new King that outclasses him.

    If I favor any of those, it's Diversification. And thus my Insane Ideas and Concepts tend to be focused on making it so things aren't "The OpsComm, but strictly worse" or "The Field Aid Engineer, but Strictly Better!" I rather move sideways.
  7. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    It's usually from people who don't understand WHY the Opsmando is balanced. All they see is people like Nite facerolling entire campaigns because he's under control of the abilities. If your only perspective is the Opsmando's strengths and none of the shortcomings, then I can absolutely see the Opsmando looking pretty overpowered. It's just that there's not enough evidence in their eyes of drawbacks, so they cry "overpowered" because they literally cannot grasp what the downside of this guy is.[hr]
    Also, I know who second and third best DPS is, and that's probably because balance is my job. Second is Combat Engineer, third is Combat Rifleman. I have every intention of rebalancing so Combat Engineer and Rifleman share a spot at Third and Arms Assault sits comfortably at Second.
  8. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Oh, I know. Though before the nerf I would have listed ModTech at third over Combat Rifleman. Just saying typically no one gives a shit about second best. Though the Combat Engineer is a bit cheesy in how beefy it gets considering it's the least Micro Intensive of DPS. Even the Rifleman at least has to hit W every 20 seconds and F every 5.
  9. CHENZ

    CHENZ New Member

    lol i was right in that opsmando is king of the hill when it comes to direct dps while combat engi comes a close second. third.. eh, who cares about third. XD

    maybe you should come up with a list of micro-intensiveness. i got the short end of the stick trying to micro an opsmando with a right-tree psi-ops leaver the other day. got so confused i shoved the flamer tank into a group of ghouls, with epic fireworks as a result =XX
  10. Shooz
    • Donator

    Shooz NOTD Staff: Killjoy

    The class synergy part of his podcast reminded me of the game where Nite and I had our ying/yang conversation. It had something to do with our colors. I totally support Kith's opinions and words on Operations Commando.
  11. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Engineer these days has to hit W on the bot every few seconds, V and E every few seconds on Engie.
    So that's actually more micro.
  12. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    I mean it'd be like me saying that I throw out Precision Shots all over as a combat rifleman. Useful, but not really Value DPS (Though does increase Micro). Overdrive on a 1 minute cool down doesn't really scream MICRO! I can't even recall of the top of my head what V is... Targeting Computer is more Icing on the Cake instead of actual Micro Requirement as the Bot can dish out a ton of damage without it. And it's only once every 10 seconds. The big Micro for the Engineer is selecting both the Bot and the Engineer and focus firing on the same target via one click.
  13. Lyanden

    Lyanden Well-Known Member

    Maybe he meant (C) for boom headshot. Kinda close to (V)

    While I agree that it's a tad on the low micro required side, it IS a 10k exp req class so I don't find it cheesy.
    Will also suffer terribly if it loses the X-1. Which gets worse if you couple that with his dismal energy regen (0.4492).


    The jump in performance it gets with more micro can get crazy though.

    1. Boom headshot
    then making both units target different units (engi with the gauss/cg/shotgun targetting the main horde, X-1 stunning anything coming near the squishies from a different angle)

    2. The X-1 kitting targets around while either
    A. keeping it in normal mode so it keeps firing (if slow moving mobs mostly) while using the targeting computer

    B. going in and out of shell mode (if the mobs are fast/ghouls/gargs/seekers)

    to mention a few.
  14. Nicarco
    • Warden
    • Donator

    Nicarco Warden

    The main reason that combat engineer is low micro intensive is because of his energy regen.

    I mean, one would avoid even sprinting if it meant taking more than 20 seconds to regenerate the 10 energy you would use moving faster for 5 seconds.
    The combat engineer is also filled with passive abilities, but if changed to actives it could make the combat engineer either a) more like the field support in having to control a menagerie or b) running into a lot of energy problems because temporary duration skills are not meant to be on a class with such low regeneration.

    The best way to change this is to make abilities that are active on the x-1 instead of on the engineer and then increase x1 regeneration or something. That way the energy regeneration can be balanced for field support while combat engy still has more micro intensive skills.
  15. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    That is false reasoning. The fact that the energy regen is low doesn't mean that it's impossible to balance the talents for more active use. Balancing energy costs works. And you have to consider that he passively has a 140% damage boost that requires nothing more than attacking a target who has more HP than a standard zombie, and he gains that damage boost in about 1 second. If you're using a Shotgun or Flamethrower you get that damage after one shot.

    Commando: 150% damage boost, requiring skill use, and has a weakened state cool down.

    Engineer: 140% damage boost based off doing nothing but regular attacks with no investment in energy or intensive micro, as long as you aren't shooting at normal zombies/ghouls.
  16. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Actually ArcV, IMA got nerfed. It's 15% per stack at level 3, which makes the maximum bonus 75%, which means it's not nearly as unreasonable. It is, however, still a 115% damage bonus that requires no real micro and no energy.

    Man, I don't know what you're talking about. I use Boom Headshot all day and have zero energy problems. What needs to happen (and what hopefully WILL happen) is as I outlined in the SUPER SEEKRIT K REPORT FOR BLACK OPS ONLY:

    Change Synergy to an active that refits the X-1 with different weaponry. What this will do will give the player conscious decisions to make as to what to outfit their X-1 with in relation to what kind of DPS they're gonna need. Put Overdrive on the bot, make building the X-1 cost more energy (I'm talking like 100 or 120 energy here, folks), and leave the Engineer with only It's Me Again and Boom Headshot. The result is more decisions to be made without fundamentally altering the Combat Engineer's gameplay.


    Oh yeah! Let me know what class tree you want me to do next.
  17. ArcanePariah
    • Development Team
    • Map Developer

    ArcanePariah Miracle Worker

    Do the most boring class ever that almost no one complains about: Recon. Seriously is the most agreed upon class, barely any of his skill provide any complaints ever.
  18. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    Assault or tech
  19. Nicarco
    • Warden
    • Donator

    Nicarco Warden

    Not talking about boom headshot or any of the engineer's current skills.

    What I am saying is that the low regen prevents the addition of more actives because you won't be able to use them all due to rising energy problems.

    Or we could just make their energy costs really low relative to other classes, but that's not really a solution. What we need is a different way to offset the energy problem, and moving it onto the x1 seems like the right way to do it.
  20. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Already did Recon though.

    Flamethrower, Assault, or Sex Ops, please.

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