Survival Mode Discussion

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Kith, Apr 9, 2012.

  1. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    [align=center]Survival Mode Discussion
    [​IMG]
    Everything related to the Survival Mode to be discussed here.[/align]


    Because Reaper forgot to make one for Survival.

    That said, I'll be kicking this off with some suggestions:

    Replace Perses with Heph. Perses is plagued by bugs making his hitpoints skyrocket in inappropriate ways, and having a flying wad of hitpoints track you down and spot for powerful ranged enemies is painfully unfair.

    Halt progression of Survival waves after Wave 35 until all units from those waves are defeated. We get into "unbeatable" and "unfair" territory when Cloaked Thors stomp up the ramp and obliterate teammates in one attack.

    Update Wave 39 from Devourers to Zulu Company. Honestly, the Devourers thing is just kinda... boring. I would much rather see something that is a direct reference to the longtime forums members, and also something unique and legitimately difficult (but not unfair). My suggestion is this:
    Randomize 8 enemies from a list of 28, each one of the 28 enemies cooresponding to a hostile version of a player class. Here are some examples:

    Jercy, the Field Engineer
    Weapon: M5 Pulse Rifle
    Additional: 3 Field Probes, 1 Field Nexus, 2 MC'd Slashers

    NiteShade, the Operations Commando
    Weapon: Flamethrower
    Additional: Drops a Nuke on the team once in range, uses Surgical Strike and Adrenaline when attacking

    DrawingDead, the Subtlety Marksman
    Weapon: SMG
    Additonal: AP Ammo, Master of Subtlety, Cloak, spawns with maximum Concentration stacks

    Diode, the Mobility Recon
    Weapon: I have no idea. SMG?
    Additional: Cloaking, Level 3 Reflexes, uses Countermeasures when attacked

    And so on and so forth. We can hash out who gets immortalized as what later if the suggestion gets accepted
    I think it will make Wave 39 a lot more interesting, and make the "hall of fame" a bit more evident to players.
  2. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Plus one for the Wave thirty nine.
  3. Thermidor

    Thermidor Well-Known Member

    Decided to bring my response to this here.

    I like this idea. It's a fun replacement.

    Just 1 question though: Are these intended to be immune to mindjacking?
  4. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

  5. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    This seems like something that should be done on a "per server" basis. Wouldn't be much of an issue as I assume theres already EU/NA/SEA specific map files/
  6. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    I wouldn't object to that. Each server has its own veterans and public figures. Also, Ghost, I apologize. I must have missed it while I was looking. Either way, we need a stickied thread for Survival, as it's just as important as the other three campaigns.

    The Veteran Marines themselves? Yes. If they come with minions (for instance Jercy's Slasher entourage) those will be mindjackable unless mechanical (the Field Probes, and so on).
  7. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Hm Nite using surg/adren might tear players apart actually, esp with flamer, should keep distance I suppose, which may be difficult when he calls a nuke in.

    Counter measures does not affect heroic, so not sure whether that could be turned into escape instead.

    Either way, would those possibly result in a lot of extra triggers? It is a nice idea and all but we are close to the limit I understand
  8. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    Just use peera's autocast + validator system; no AI needed. Basically you'd set the units to use their skills whenever enemies (the players) hit them, come within range, or can be seen. Whatever method you choose.
  9. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Thus, ArcCon: When shot by a marine, casts Flare at Marines.

    Also don't mind if wave 39 is really recockulously hard. Remember The Man said Survival should have a 5% chance. Not the 80% chance in Nightmare that teams have now.
  10. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    I dunno, maybe have the heroes spawn instead of GOTB who is really cheesy anyway.
  11. Arcelia

    Arcelia New Member

    Just a little thought.
    How much HP and shields would these evil classes have?
    If its the same it would be pretty easy.
  12. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Probably like wave 33 minis +100%
  13. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Actually.... I wouldn't mind if they had the same stats as normal marines. However they have Karmic Twin Bonuses. In this case meaning that they are effected by things like an allied Marine would be. Only take the nerfed friendly fire damage from Stingers. Barrett can't attack them, crowbar doesn't hurt them. Can't cast "Enemy only" talents on them, so no OSOKing them or Rifleman Grenades...

    *evil finger temple* Excellent...

    Have them spawn together, so you don't face them one at a time but face them as a Unit.
  14. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    The intent was that they were to spawn together, yes.

    Also, Ghost: The Nuke would indeed instantly kill players if they're stupid enough to stay within the radius. The marker indicatior will still very much be present and the cast time will be the same, so there's more than enough time for the players to get the fuck out of the way.

    The intent of abilities: The Zulu Company, as I've dubbed it, will have retooled abilities that affect heroics. They won't have access to all abilities from the trees (for instance, the Marksman bosses won't have Scope as that would just be incredibly unfair for them to see up walls and make any strategic positioning a non-factor).
  15. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Yes of course, what I meant was: Commando sees players, casts Nuke. Activates Surg/Adren. Players evade nuke and may just run into commando and get wiped.

    But since you say the enemy will spawn as a unit, that probably won't happen. Would be more likely if they all spawned apart and attacked from several sides.

    Btw, if they spawn together, what's to prevent players to just counter nuke them all at once? Their AI wouldn't evade a nuke or similar.
  16. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Liaison

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Bugs, Pugs, and Scruggs

    It's wave 39 so I say all bets are off. Let Blaqk the Mind Mastery Psi Ops have Inception, let ArcanePariah the Combat Engineer have Overdrive, and so on.
  17. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Nothing is preventing the players from nuking Zulu Company.

    I dunno about that. I'm trying to avoid it becoming enemy cheese, you know? Something that can be an actual fight instead of instant death if the enemy catches you in open ground.
  18. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Remove minis from wave 33 and move other waves up. Heph wave 35 boss. Once defeated spawn nydus for 36, mech 37, demeter 38, minis + hero 39.
    Although I'd rather see gotb removed and heroes for 40.
  19. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    As silly as he is, I like GOTB. He's a nice bit of nostalgia for we who are exceptionally old farts. Also, I don't think the heroes need mini support. We're talking 8 full tree marine classes, which can get incredibly difficult, incredibly fast. They'll be capable of mulching the team in a flash. For example, the Pathfinder is capable of spelling instant doom for the team if he gets close, even moreso if he drops No Quarter on them. The Assassination Marksman will be capable of dealing 600 damage to the first enemy he sees with Master Assassin OSOK. The Forward Observer can drop a Fire Mission on the team, or Firebats. The list goes on.
  20. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Liaison

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Bugs, Pugs, and Scruggs

    Wont be enemy cheese. Inception is the only oddball of the Tier 3s because it's a timescale effect.

    Actually that raises an unrelated question that I'll pose in the generic thread.

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