Stalkers & Creep

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Lord NiteShade, Apr 5, 2012.

  1. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    This isn't for any official purposes, I'm just curious. What's the general opinion on Stalkers producing creep. As far as I can tell they are possibly both the fastest and most numerous creep producing enemy. I might be missing a few enemies, but off the top of my head the only other creep spawners I can think of are Infestors, Agrons Titans, and Hulks.
  2. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    I think seekers too.

    Generally I find creep production to be annoying particularly because creep has such higj HP that it takes forever to clear without use of instant aoe damage skills.
  3. CHENZ

    CHENZ New Member

    and i find thst it wastes too much ammo especially when people are walking around the map using attack move or move rather than hold-fire move.
  4. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    I tend to find that other units seem to spawn creep more than Stalkers. Thus why Dome A tends to be harder on teams that aren't just AoE bombing it from long range than Dome C is. All that damned creep means you're either constantly falling back or they're instantly upon you.
  5. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Move creep tumor spawning to be an autocast of the Infestor that happens every minute or so. Makes Infestors more worthwhile to hunt down, and makes random creep drops due to Stalkers less likely to wipe the team.
  6. JAW

    JAW Well-Known Member

    Since stalkers seem to be the only thing that doesn't charge in -nm, the creep seems to be the only thing that keeps them on par with all their buddies. One idea is that creep could be moved to -nm mode only. It's not like people aren't winning any games at all because of this creep, it's more annoying than excessively deadly.
  7. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    The fact that it's basically nothing more than an annoyance is a problem. I say we make it into something that's a legitimate concern.
  8. SirGalahad

    SirGalahad New Member

    i don't think stalkers should spawn creep at all. stalkers spawning creep goes back to the old question of skill vs luck. if a stalker dies and spawns creep in a bad location, thus creating a highway of creep for subsequent mobs, this can easily lead to an extremely dangerous situation for a team, especially on nm where almost everything charges. alternatively, if people really want the creep spawns to stay, i really think that randomly spawned creep should be easier to kill. i'm not sure what the attributes of the creep are, but i think it takes around 10 knife swings in order to kill, which is far too high. random creep needs to be able to killed with regular weapons, such as the gauss, so that even if creep spawns in a poor location, a team's regular weapon damage (through rifle fire) should be able to kill it relatively quickly.

    if none of these changes is acceptable, at least make the base percentage chance of creep spawning lower and tie it to sr.

    regarding the argument that stalkers dont charge so spawning creep balances them with other mobs: this is a bit disingenuous. mobs are not supposed to be equally deadly. a zombie is far less scary than a slasher, for instance. stalkers are very common mobs and are already granted a high base movespeed and the dangerous ability to climb walls. having stalkers spawn creep simply allows them to give already deadly enemies (like charging parasites and seekers) the power to grant instant death.

    *edit* after thinking about it, i really like the idea of infestors spawning random creep every so often. this gives teams a much greater incentive to kill them earlier and also eliminates some of the issues that i have with the inability to kill creep during already dangerous holdouts. the only issue i see is that creep spawning every minute could easily cover large portions of the map in creep, which would be deadly on storylines such as apollo sec where early infestor hunting is extremely dangerous. every infestor spawning a tumour every five minutes is a lot more balanced, in my opinion, because it still allows teams to skip one or two infestors without worrying about running into an area covered in hard-to-kill creep. also, the ability to spawn creep obviously would need to be removed if the infestor is mind controlled by an engineer.
  9. Lyanden

    Lyanden Well-Known Member

    I disagree.

    Creep spawning gives getting rid of stalkers a sense of urgency. Without it, they're just another tough zombie
    and without charge at that.

    The fact that it is capable of possibly creating a sudden high way to hell is something you want to avoid.
    This gives players things to think about in game and strengthens the fact that strategy, tactics and reflex are very much needed in NOTD

    Considering a given team's position in the map/surroundings (backed into a corner or have room to run etc), team composition, horde composition, do we want these guys dead asap or not?

    These guys might spawn creep, do we want them dead far away from us, speed up hordes getting to us (but we can move back/retreat) or are we fine with the creep being under us and just focus on not letting anything get onto the creep near us in the first place because it's kinda hard to retreat with creep under you given speed buff on enemies and debuff on us? etc etc

    It's another factor that keeps the game from being just a "let your character shoot whatever comes your way via auto acquiring targets"-fest.

    The fact that it's not guaranteed to spawn creep to me means that if the team made the wrong decision, then there's a chance that the stalker is a 'dud' and you avoid the 'oh shit' scenario.

    If it's not a 'dud' however and spawns creep, it becomes a 'you knew what was coming' scenario.
    Prepare for fast slashers and projectile ghouls.

    In NM, creep suddenly popping up should not be seen as an annoyance and must be treated the same way we treat creep in the airlock. If you're on it and it's on -nm, you're in grave danger. gtfo the creep or get rid of it, fast

    Implementation suggestions (for nm):
    Either give them a larger radius,
    make them harder to kill (make flamers be the ideal weapon for them :p/smaller hp, a ton more armor or make them "structures" and give flamers a sizable bonus vs structures while buffing creep hp)
    or have a really high chance of being created upon stalker death.

    Would also suggest letting them keep spreading if not killed immediately but that would be over kill. XD
  10. poor_newb

    poor_newb Member

    if you actually managed to die to stalker creep then you seriously need to play better

    if you just didn't like stalker creep, stop complaining and deal with it, it's a part of the game. not everyone is going to like everything in it, and just because a few people on the forums find a feature in the game "annoying" doesn't mean it's ok to ruin it for everybody else, some of whom who actually do like that feature, and many of whom don't even use the forums
  11. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    I'm going to jump in and say there is a flaw in that logic.

    A) We cannot get the opinions of people who don't speak up. This applies in everything in life. People who don't vote shouldn't bitch about the outcome of elections, etc.

    B) You cannot base decisions off the guessed at opinions of people who will not speak up.

    C) You do realize you have a minority who are actually active. However, just because they are active doesn't mean that they are all in the same camp. Use them to gauge what the cross section of the community might look like, because honestly you don't really have any other way to do it.

    That said I do actually agree with you. Stalker creep is fine as is. The only places with serious stalker spam are either places you are about to abandon (Early Alpha Company Holdouts), or situations you should have planned for far in advance (Queen Holdout).

    If anything is done to nerf it a bit, the only thing I'd like to see is give Creep perhaps Fire Vulnerability necessarily. Let the Flamethrowers clean it out faster than taking the 4-5 shots that are needed.

    Fire cleanses.
  12. Froblock

    Froblock Well-Known Member

    I have voted "Stalkers spawn creep too often."
    My reasoning is that they spawn creep 100% of the time when they die and its very instant.
    When ghouls/slashers/devo's/ all the things u would hate to be kiting solo are behind u and stalker lays teh creep. You are pretty much 80% going to lose a life.

    In nightmare, the chances of you getting assraped increases by that damned much.
    And also in said nightmare mode, there are even more stalkers.

    Maybe a decrease in creep spawn may help. Possibly even a 20-30% decrease in chance of spawning creep.
  13. SirGalahad

    SirGalahad New Member

    if you want to ignore the input of people who play the game, then why bother having forums at all? the point of the forums is for players to give feedback to the various features of the map. just because not everyone agrees on the issue does not make the discussion irrelevant.

    also, it is completely wrong for anybody to unilaterally decide that the people who do not use the forum feel one way or another. i could easily say the opposite, and nobody would be able disprove it. the people who post in the forum do not represent the majority, but they form a valuable cross-section of the populace that helps the developers make better decisions about their game.

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