Shell Limit on Arty FO

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Ability, Feb 25, 2012.

  1. Ability
    • Development Team
    • NOTD Creator

    Ability NOTD Creator

    The shell limit was originally designed so that Arty can dish out insane damage in a short time (i.e. higher damage potential than an Air FO), but that is kept in check by a physical shell limitation.

    I'd like to know from your personal experience if this mechanics is what you're seeing in practice. If people are happy enough with it, then we'll leave it as that. We got more than enough things to do atm as it is.
  2. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    To be honest, I almost never keep track of the shell count in my game. Practical experience says even in a longer mode like Easy Company, I'm not going to run out of shells. I can get to Eos's Death with probably around 400 shells left, and leading the Kill Tally.

    But it's also a product of Skill, which is a nice balance point. If you have someone that grips and rips with 20/20 shell barrages for everything they will end up running out of shells only halfway through the storyline. Players who have experimented with it though knows they can run barrages around 8-10 shells for usually the same net effect (Particularly once Satellite is up), and have no real worries about the amount of shells they will have.

    So last thoughts.... the limitation on Shells is more of a newbie limitation rather than a real limitation. Which is fine. The only thing that really stops the Artillery FO isn't the shell count but just timing out the barrages so you don't whiff or have Napalm burning over some egress you need.
  3. ArcanePariah
    • Development Team
    • Map Developer

    ArcanePariah Miracle Worker

    The only modification I could see is upping the shell count in NM games only, the only way I've seen NM alpha even become survivable is have Arty FO bomb Apollo back to the stone age. To be more exact, me and the SEA vets tried it last night and we lived though the start only by having 2 Art FO's unleash about 600-700 shells each. A single FO wouldn't necessarily use double the shells, but still the start would require probably around 600+ shells to fully suppress/destroy the immortal waves. Toss in Gas Sequence and Lab, and your mostly likely sucking on fumes for shells by IVAX, where you need about 200-300 to be effective there.
  4. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    If shell count is truly a restriction, add a marine action skill called "Munitions Requisition" which adds X shells for Y energy. Artillery is much less energy intensive than air support, so it should be no problem finding energy to use on said skill.
  5. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    What Nite said.
    Can be innate FO skill.
  6. marloelikeswaffles

    marloelikeswaffles New Member

    I find the shell limit to be JUST BARELY enough for -nm (usually like 100 or so shells left over), so a skill that can add a few more would probably give people the "safety net" they need to overuse when necessary.

    I would increase or remove the shell limit for survival, though. An art FO in survival has a LOT of trouble balancing his shell use - and a skill to add more might not be enough.

    Could pay a bounty of 100-200 shells per chapter or wave clear.
  7. Mirage
    • Donator

    Mirage ಠ_ಠ What are you looking at?

    Could always make supply station regen them too?
  8. Lyanden

    Lyanden Well-Known Member

    So some say the limit put on arti shells makes NM difficult for Arti FOs while others say that it is doable but that it takes more skill.

    I propose that instead of consuming energy, make the shells/"Munitions Requisition" something that's purchasable from the shop.

    This way it'll be like someone buying an SMG/Stinger/L3 Grenade Launcher. It's not required that you do. NM and other modes are still doable w/o them. But it does help if you do buy them/make additional requisitions.

    Also a +1 to the suggestion on Survival + FOs. Instead of making it w/o limits however, I suggest just doubling the amount. Infinite arti shells would just end with 3-4 FOs bombarding a ramp with shells/stuns/napalm for the whole game.

    Heck, even just them all spamming stuns while the rest of the team does the DPS might take down the GOTB.
  9. Mirage
    • Donator

    Mirage ಠ_ಠ What are you looking at?

    I think ideally you would just remove the limitation, but make each shell make it cost more energy by like perhaps.. 0.35 or something like that, I mean come on where would artillary like this come from; I'd like to think some sort of ship in low orbit.. :D
  10. Ability
    • Development Team
    • NOTD Creator

    Ability NOTD Creator

    The shop purchase idea sounds solid.

    Skill that replenishes shells with energy...key challenge is that it may reduce the need to discriminate use of shells. How do we balance the skill required in Air FO?

    Increasing Shells available in Survival is right. Rather than a quota shell award after each level, would it be better if the game airdrops it near FO location so they still need to work to get it? I've no strong opinions on this atm.
  11. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    M£ake it cost energy and magazines.
  12. Lyanden

    Lyanden Well-Known Member

    I would go with just the bonus per level.

    Unless you turn it into an item which anyone can pick up for the FO (but make sure only an FO can use/click the item). :p
  13. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Rather it cost energy, but have a very long cool down.

    Say something like "Add 15/30/45 shells. Cool down, 3 minutes". (Replacing the Lunar Boosters)

    It would still add potentially hundreds of shells to a Artillery FO over a long game. However it won't allow them to constantly spam shells without regard. Nor will it allow them to load up on 500 extra shells or something during a small lull in the action.

    And I don't think it would add too much to the "Skill imbalance". Losing Boosters means that Arty FOs would have to plan their salvos a bit better. And the relatively small amount of shells added over time doesn't mean they can make up with it by carpet bombing with mass spam.
  14. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Lunar boosters are quite useful especially on NM though where creepfields are more common and enemies charge.

    I support an innate skill which is unlocked with Fire Mission and costs energy and mags and has a long cooldown.
    Mags because it will make the team think whether to give ammo to the FO to convert into shells or whether to go via conventional means instead.

    Logic-wise, it makes little sense as mags aren't somehow beamed up to a gunship, but balance wise it makes sense.
  15. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    Logic wise it makes as much sense as using the same ammo for a pistol and a stinger.
  16. Arturia

    Arturia Well-Known Member

    Its more like The Same Ammo for a Stinger, Grenade launcher, Pistol, Flamethrower, and a Barret, soon to be a Railgun as well.
  17. Zuriel

    Zuriel Well-Known Member

    Suggestion: new side quest that rewards players with shells.

    Since this quest is entirely optional, and only essential if There's an FO around, no exp will be awarded. The reward is X amount of shells.
  18. Yuey
    • Warden

    Yuey Warden

    I think upping the shell limit count to somewhere between 1800 and 2000 for NM mode only would be a good solution if its possible. The point being that, there needs to be a slight buffer in case an arty FO has to overuse at some point of the story.

    The other option I was mulling was adding the innate FO skill to replenish shells once you level artillery bombardment but with a slight twist. Reducing the maximum shell limit to just 500 but having the innate skill instantly replenish all 500 for 150 energy on a 10 minute cooldown. And you can't stack the shells, meaning that the maximum shells you can stock up will only ever be 500. (Lore-wise: Whatever's firing the bombardments can only have space to hold 500 shells at a time and the replenishment is a quick supply call to somewhere to send the shells over to the artillery pieces.)
  19. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    I like yuey's idea.
  20. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    I like Yuey's idea as well, but I'm not sure about the huge cooldown on the requisition. I think the requisition requiring ALL of the FO's energy is more than enough.

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