Questions and Suggestions.

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Shooz, Feb 5, 2012.

  1. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    Hm why? Crowbar already op anyway. Rs just allows the use of it more.
    Also having a shield and using a one hand melee weapon does effect speed.

    However the speed loss is so minimal I'm not even bothered.
  2. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    I don't see how the crowbar is op at all.

    And yes, while it does effect speed, it doesn't effect speed in the same way that using a projectile weapon with recoil does. A shield and melee weapon is more natural than a shield and a rifle.

    I suppose the argument could be made that one could make use of the Pistol and possibly the SMG to full effect while using the shield, but I'd rather we not get into that for various reasons.
  3. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    Is the purpose of the timer on coms to keep people from cheesing it, or do we want people to fail coms if they get pushed off the hex by too many spawns forcing a retreat? I had a game yesterday where we stayed on the hex until we started getting wrecked and retreated south under fire. I charged back to the hex as soon as I could, but we still failed coms by a few seconds.
  4. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    It is from stopping cheese yes.
    Currently even failing but dling gives speed.
    When fixed it will actually require a decent CC to be done.
  5. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    People bitch about Comms being too hard, so I'd say give it another minute to be completed.

    I'm also about ready to put in the new Speed timer, Recon Rework or no. The roundabout measure of Comms being required for Speed was only supposed to last a month or so, and I'm tired of seeing it.
  6. Niktos

    Niktos Well-Known Member

    If new speed timers for acnm and secnm are not below 1h15 (like 1h12 or 10 even) i don't see them changing anything. On the other hand i'm not sure if i ever did ecnm in sub 1h20 time. Fastest acnm we managed without changing anything in current eu tactics was 1h08 with Ghost at begining of this year and we got under 1h10 like 3times in a row same day. For secnm A path from Ghost challenge was ~57min if i remember corectly, and fastest B path i ever did was 1h6-7.
  7. brizingr5

    brizingr5 Member

    ^those numbers are from pros and probably deserve to be getting speed. Just throwing that out there.
  8. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    The new Alpha Speed timer is supposed to be an hour flat, or an hour and ten minutes. Easy Company's might get reduced by ten minutes, and Sec is getting left alone.
  9. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    Can you elaborate on your reasoning please?
  10. Niktos

    Niktos Well-Known Member

    So ec will be forced into 'pub route' with ninja scouting to cut it out for speed, it got too much hard parts that you simply can't do faster so only way to make it faster is 'outsourcing' the scout to either ninja team of 2 whatevers or mobcon/smm alone with smm having hardtime coz of small inventory.

    As for sec -nm, from my experience it is 1h 10-15 close to moh or moh win, or a wipe on hades regardles if we use dual smm stinging or 4rofles and amm, or any setup that actually can kill hades. It simply is speed, non speed nm wins from sec i have are from 2man runs or soloing hades for 30min as tech/pf with sting. So i would personally cut it down as well.

    For acnm i can't really count it up on the spot but i don't think under 1h is manageable without simply not doing seth/comms/not to mention chems. And from earlier posts of 'perfect' bonus you yourself stated that perfect speed should be possible.
  11. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    Far as EC i recall recon being reworked. so that was meant to help with the "scouting". So i have no clue about it
    Agree with sec nm and ac nm.
  12. Arturia

    Arturia Well-Known Member

    If anything, the speed timer should get progressively lower. I.e. Easy Co has the longest, Alpha in between, Sec, Lowest.

    If you think about it, Easy Company has no real "Deadline" at which they must be finished. Easy is the cleansing of Apollo; it doesn't have a set time schedule at which point infestation suddenly peaks. That said, the Queen is incubating for the majority of the storyline; if they take too long, she can possibly become a monstrosity of impossible proportions, wiping out Easy Company, as well as anything the UGC can possible send. That is why Easy Company still has a time limit.

    Alpha has a small "Deadline" but it isn't as prominent as Easy's. First Team to arrive at the scene, they eventually shut down the infection for a bit. The Arrive after Apollo Security, which had dealt a massive strike to the infection. However, Alpha Co. has a "Deadline" in that HAL & Black Ops are around there, possibly waiting to terminate them. In another case, Perseus would completely knock out the skies, as well as annihilate the facility. If they aren't fast enough, Perseus could possibly be charging a massive fire wave that wipes them entirely out. Hence, they have an accelerated schedule, but it isn't as if they don't have some time.

    Apollo Security however, has the strictest "Deadline" simply because its the start and peak of the infection. If they take way too long, they'll be overwhelmed by the massive initial outbreak. Apollo Sec plays a major role in devastating the infection by massively damaging its ability to be recreated / reproduced by slaying Hades. If they don't meet that "Deadline" the infestation, which is at its peak during this time, will wipe Apollo Sec out. As a result, Apollo Sec has to be the quickest story-line of them all in order to preemptively strike Hades and stop the infestation from Overflowing.

    The general idea can be the urgency & critical states of each Story Line. If they situation is critical, and they have no time to waste, they'd have a lower speed timer, with the opposite applied as well.

    It isn't like the game should suddenly become harder after the Speed Timer has passed though. But going off what I said, it is more like the Speed Timer is really the Peak Infestation Timer; how long until shit hits the fan with overwhelming force, but oh well. That isn't something that NOTD needs. I'm just using it to help justify how I think speed timers should be.

    So in terms of Speed Timers:

    Easy > Alpha > Apollo is what I think should happen.
  13. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Alpha Speed in under an hour is super easy if the team does Seth while two other teammates go to do Comms and then grab Airlock items and meet up with the rest of the team during or right before Cronus (or to go do Chems after Seth, depending on if the team is shooting for Perfect Speed or not). If Comms is not a speed requirement, Hour-speed is possible if the team foregoes Comms entirely. Airlock can easily be raided by a single careful player.
  14. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    Ac speed even at its current difficulty isn't possible in under 1hr. (atleast on nm with avg SQ of 2000). I've only been once in an ac nm in 58minutes. That was with most ppl atleast 8 mods. The ones with max buying items at start. So on. This was when Comms wasn't required. With no chem leaks done. Most acs average 1hr 15mins. Pro lobbies average 1hr and 8minutes.(not 100% accurate)
    Your scenario is only possible if team goes armory right away. Doesn't do airlock and has had nexus coordinates with a reaper or something. Is also on low SQ or has weapon bought from start.
    How are comms able to be done by only 2 people? Most teams struggle with 8.
  15. Ryan III

    Ryan III Well-Known Member

    Perhaps we should just reduce speed time for normal alpha speed and not nightmare? Nightmare is extremely hard to complete in an hour, normally, nightmare alpha games I join take at least 1 hour and 10-20 minutes.
  16. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Speed is only possible if the teams cut out the additional activities and go as quickly as possible to complete the objectives while wasting the least amount of time?

    For some reason, I don't see a problem.

    And yes, two people. A Mobcon and a SubMM can rotate cloaks and kiting and get the job done with a performance bonus, no less. It is not my fault more people haven't figured that out yet.
  17. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    It means you're relying on luck and no scouting to complete the mode. Or buyers.

    In theory is possible. In practicality it really isn't just 1 detect and a hug near is most likely gg. I'd like this theory to be proven. Since I think again, you're relying on luck mainly.
  18. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Or I'm relying on a dedicated team of scouts rather than having the ENTIRE FUCKING TEAM tour the map to find shit. The Mobcon and SubMM go fast for a reason.


    In theory a single Mobcon could do it. In practice a Mobcon and a SubMM can do it with ease, assuming the two are coordinated. Juggle cloaking and kiting and have the SubMM attack the Detectors or the Huggers. It's not hard, I promise.
  19. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    It's true. Nowadays people just do the ac nm path to go to armory. They don't scout really.
    How others team do. Another possibility is that team split in 2. 1 goes top 1 goes bottom.

    I still find the 1hour perfect speed hardly possible. I suggest testing before assuming.
    I have a super speed ac nm designed. I shall test it and see the results. With how ac is currently build (chem not included)
  20. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    All of the Alpha NM Speeds that I've gotten have been the team following a set path that scouts the entire map and ends up at Armory in the beginning and then going to Comms after Seth and then scouting airlock and then going to Labs. That's at least 20 minutes of frivolous team movement that doesn't need to happen.

    Perfect Speed is supposed to be difficult and require an enormous amount of coordination and effort. Only the top 5 percent of players should have Perfect Speed wins. Perfect Speed is supposed to be the ultimate test of skill, and making it anything less than borderline impossible makes it worthless as one.

Share This Page