Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Shooz, Feb 5, 2012.
Burst Fire, Frenzy, HMG going away now? Probably for the best.
But yeah, makes sense.
It was better with stinger. Since thats all stingy really needed. Speed+Damage. Makes it pyros favorite gun for Ivax, if you can find victims to burn for frenzy. Since, his flamer will do crap to ivax, getting close is dangerous, no one should be within stingers aoe, and Burn cant be useful against Ivax anyways since u end up moving/cancelling.
Problem with that fight and Flamethrowers being that there is never any mobs around. And if they are they are bitchslapped by IVAX before they ever get close to any sort of mass to be worth a damn. Least in my experience across all difficulty levels.
Since survival's changes it has become such an easy conduit for channel players to gain XP and credits faster and easier than playing other game modes,
I suggest that we do an increase in zombie's movespeed just for Survival mode.
Maybe a 10% increase in movespeed for zombies.
I'm not that good with #'s and how well balanced it is in game
so if anyone can come up with a more reasonable percentage of speed increase please help.
Survival's hard as shit, Fro. I dunno about that. If they're doing well at survival, then they're organized, and that's a good thing.
Most who do well or find it easy use sec team classes which are OP as shit in surv.
I dunno about that Kith.
Running around in circles and holding at EC Muta seems a lot easier than organizing an EC, Alpha or Apollo
where every team member plays a part and must have the know how of what to expect and what has to be done.
Scratch that. Let me play a solid 20 games of survival first to really see whats up.
Survival in general is piss easy. There's only a few waves that seem capable of killing people.
Until 20 the only hard waves I can think of are Tart/Ely (If the team is functionally retarded), Wave 13 (If the team doesn't understand how to kite), or wave 17 (this can be a legitimate threat.)
If the Apollo classes are OP, how about survival specific nerfs, mostly to regen or movespeed. Or, we could change the usage requirements for them in survival to require very high rating.
I personally think low man (2-3) player survivals are too easy, and need the spawns increased to as if it was a 6-7 player matche to compensate the fact they will earn exponentially more credits.
I don't Survival that much. And it's no great secret I don't like it. It seems to be popular because there is usually some cheese going on. I don't know what cheese they are running since the Gates have opened up... I'm sure there is one though.
The one I'm kinda surprised at is that the cheesers don't use that platform on the North Airlock Entrance that doesn't have any possible way to access it, other than Griefer Gunning. Too small for stuff to spawn on it, no ramps up to it or anything. Not sure why it isn't used by them. I know it's pathable terrain because there's always some zombies that get stuck up there in Easy Company, after the Erebos Waves.
Oh but they do use it on EU.
I hate survival mainly because you can't get a decent game going without someone (or indeed 3+) people going PF and abusing the heck out of the map.
Take out Sec Team classes and Survival becomes a challenge and fun to play as well as a test of skills.
Jack up the rating requirement for Sec Team classes in Surv to 1950. Problem solved.
It's less that the Sec Team classes are overpowered and more that they're designed to handle different situations. The Pathfinder is incredibly good at Survival because he's extremely mobile for both trees. His left tree grants him ample range to deal with threats, and his right tree makes him more mobile and also capable of burst damage based on how long it's been since he's last attacked. He's more along the lines of "adequate" in Apollo B NM because either he's dealing okay-ish damage with his handguns or he's doing some extremely dangerous bullshit by going out and stomping the later mobs. Early mobs are less of a problem because they're relatively few and far between, but when things get really heavy and stingers are being thrown left and right and Force pushes and Contamination fields and Black Dogs and all sorts of other fun shit? Discretion becomes the better part of Valor.
Pathfinder still needs Peera's more fluid jumps that have actual travel times and whatnot, as well as the change from full throttle to a flat sprint upgrade before its balanced. I'd almost suggest removing it from Surv until these changes happen because currently it is maddeningly overpowered.
As per Karma thread, how would making it a ratings requirement differ or be more advantageous than a Karma requirement? Does high rating mean less abusive? Endurance grants lives fast enough anyway.
I would much rather Sec Team classes not be selectable altogether and not randomable either in Surv. Problem solved.
High rating means that you're good enough at the game that you can be trusted with the more powerful classes. You would legitimately have to work to boost your rating to gain access to the Pathfinder in Survival. Also, I'm really, really, really against just outright restricting access to four different classes because there's a problem that we can't solve. That's lazy and stupid.
And reminds me of all the stupid shit that has been changed over the years merely because the Griefer Gun has existed, where if the Gun didn't exist, there would have been no need to monkey around with it.
Like most of the Survival Cheesing that is done.
Keep the Chem then, he's alright.
But MoTM, Foresight/SoT, Rocket PF are incredibly powerful in Surv and not quite limited in their roles, item availability, level speed and utility as they would be in Sec Team.
Arc, Speed of Tought would still do exactly the same that GG would do for exploits
Much harder to set up.
As far as exploits it requires you to have a friendly unit to teleport into, meaning most reliably a FO, maybe a SurvCon, I haven't seen any Sex Ops try it with my Reaper yet. But even then without a Griefer Gun it only allows Sex Ops of the Mind Mastery tree to do those exploits. You can't exploit the entire team.
And I think it'd be a hard sale for someone to say "Join my Surv Game, sacrifice yourself to me so I can reap all the benefits!"
How about instead of limiting classes and making me have an aneurism at the design choices being proposed that take away choice from the player for no reason other than "we don't know how to fix it so we're just going to take it away", how about we do what AM did?
And what I mean by that is increase spawn rate based on classes chosen. In AM, the Predator UAV was awesome. It was a recon unit that could fly (not a T3 of the Force Recon, but a class in and of itself). But you know what picking the Pred did? It made zombie spawns absolutely fucking skyrocket. I say we give increased enemy spawn rates when out-of-storyline classes are randomed, or in Survival, give increased enemy spawn rates when the Alpha and Sec Team classes are chosen. Couple this with the increased rating requirement and the amount of "overpowered classes" will drop and also things will become much more balanced in terms of difficulty when they ARE present.
Fuck this "it's overpowered so we need to get rid of it altogether", one of the major pulls of Survival is that you can play any class that you want.
Get a team of Psi Ops and PFs mainly and a tech who can hold himself NP due to MotM
Its not too difficult. MobRec can take care of any other classes who happen to have been picked.
Like I said, PFs can still get up and down walls using Jump.
I like that idea actually Kith, but the extra spawns need to be of the flying and/or ranged variety. Or heck, make picking certain classes guarantee a higher HP perses who also gains extra ms lol
I've already said, this is a product of the sloppy teleport jumps. I've seen peeras jumps firsthand, and they lack the issue. If Pathfinder is fixed, he is no longer overpowered. This appears to be quantum science that Unfinished=Overpowered, Finished=Balance. It's no different from when the early incarnation of Technician could cure any ailment by opening and shutting his cockpit. If you want older examples, Arms Ass only used 1 mag per reload, regardless of ammo feed, Engineer could make infinite X1s, and Commando could stack damage indefinetly.
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