Kith's Assault Rework

Discussion in 'Class Discussion' started by Kith, May 17, 2012.

  1. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    [align=center]Kith’s Assault Rework
    Or more like "the switcheroo" because there isn't actually much to change

    Fresh new thread because these proposed Assault changes in Black Ops are all tied up in the K Report rework megathread and I don't feel like digging them out. To make a long story short, because the Assault is no longer completely bogged down by Suppressive Fire, Charge isn't really necessary as a T3 for Arms because he doesn't explicitly require a movement aid because he no longer moves at half the speed of smell, but there's another tree that could use it for a variety of reasons. That said:


    Stun replaced by Charge

    Charge - Active: 20 energy cost, 5 second cooldown
    The Assault charges forward with heroic zeal up to 12 distance to the targeted point, knocking back any enemies in his path and damaging them.

    "He charged forth, borne upon red wings of rage."

    Level 1 - Deals 50 damage to all affected enemies (+50% to Massive targets) and stuns them for 2 seconds.
    Level 2 - Deals 100 damage to all affected enemies (+50% to Massive targets) and stuns them for 4 seconds.

    The bottom line is that Stun and Charge basically accomplish the same task: disruption. The problem is that the Protection Assault has been hailed as the most boring of the tanks because he's simply straight defense. He has no offensive capability and nowhere near the mobility that the other tanks do. This switch will fix both problems, making the Assault not only more mobile, but give players something to do damage-wise, aiding in leveling and giving the Protection Assault a way to mitigate swarms of small enemies (which are basically the Assault's natural predators).

    Many have asked for me to consider giving the Assault a natural ailment resistance, or to buff Cohesion with some sort of Combat Hardened style ailment removal. I've been very reluctant to even suggest such a change because then playing the Protection Assault would become a no-brainer: It doesn't matter how many hits you take, just mash that Cohesion and the ailments won't stack up on you. It'd make the Protection Assault nigh-untouchable.

    But why do I bring that up? Because I think Charge will fill that role quite nicely. With a light damage option in addition to a mobility one, the Assault will be able to mitigate swarms of light units by either running them over or by getting away from them. It's a much more acceptable measure because then it requires the player to actually prevent the ailments rather than rely on a passive effect or constant button pressing to mitigate them.


    Slow removed from Concentrated Fire
    The Tier 1 spammable already has a thought-provoking mechanic with its duration being longer than the cooldown.

    Blood Frenzy gaining a MS slow
    A nice 10% MS loss to compensate for being one of the better damage buffs in the game and for handing out disables like candy.

    Charge replaced with Harvester of Sorrow

    Harvester of Sorrow - Active: 25 energy cost, 30 second cooldown, 30 second duration
    The Assault sings a song of war, attacking with hateful zeal and bringing doom to his foes.

    "Let the beatings begin!"

    Level 1 - The Assault gains 30% bonus damage and 20% bonus Critical Strike, while losing 10% movespeed. If the Assault scores a Critical Hit on an enemy while Concentrated Fire is active, they will suffer a 50% attack and movespeed loss.

    Adapted from ArcturusV's Overwatch ability that he suggested for one of the numerous Submando reworks, it's one that I personally enjoyed very much. It synergized well with the Arms Assault's crit-happy and ministun-happy nature, and I feel it's much more appropriate than Charge as a Tier 3, even moreso now that his movement is not nearly as hindered as it used to be.

    The entire purpose of the Arms Assault is to shoot a hell of a lot of bullets and to shoot them well, so I figured that yet another damage buff and something that synergized with the all of the other abilities in the tree was warranted.

    Do note that the original design called for increased damage taken by enemies, ALA Heightened Senses. I wanted to avoid that because A: It would be a total nightmare to code and B: I'd prefer the effect be restricted to players and not minis to avoid Charlie Company/Sheng's Boys becoming amazingly brutal sources of DPS.
  2. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    Does charge still have its annoying knockback of agro lose. It could honestly just be a shove.
  3. Miracle
    • Development Team
    • Community Leader

    Miracle NOTD Staff: Assistant of many things

    The idea of having charge on protection Assault is nice, levelling up should be a lot easier especially when you can't find a shotgun or even a flamethrower.

    I think overwatch is a bit too powerful though, you could keep the damage bonus up for the whole game if you use it every 30 seconds, maybe the duration should be just a bit shorter than the cooldown?
  4. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Ops

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Operations and Web

    Not if he wants to take advantage of that synergy. Assault has shit for energy so he wont be able to spam Blood Frenzy and Whateveritscallednow Fire and reliably hammer Overwatch.

    Even so, Heightened Senses has virtually the same damage buff and can and should be "always on".
  5. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    I think Overwatch should be "Player Controlled" necessarily instead of "Player marines". Let the Preds get in, if they want. Or X1s. Or Reapers. Might unintentionally include Charlie Company Reinforcements for dead guys. But not exactly as bad as having ALL of Charlie Company getting it.
  6. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Considering the lack of other actives, the Assault could easily make use of Taunt after Charge. And sometimes, its good to break aggro.
  7. Emperor

    Emperor New Member

    Shit now my Assault is going to be slow all the time.
  8. Waves_Blade

    Waves_Blade New Member

    As long as charge keeps its "VALHALLA IM COMIIINNGG!!!!"

    God I love hearing that.
  9. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    He'll at least get a big boost to dps to warrant his slowness, Emp.
  10. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    Arms assault changes from the role of a battering ram to a trebuchet. Tanky lower dps to heavier dps that's slow as hell and is difficult to set up. I like it.
  11. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    That was always the intent. Problem was he's ALWAYS had some form of lolderp melee T3.
  12. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Well, Charge is legitimately useful. I'm not going to say that it's not. It's just... "allow the class to kite in bursts" doesn't really fit for a Tier 3.

    Although I really did love scaring the hell out of HopelessNoob with it when it first came out.

    "Hope. Hope. Hey. Hope. Hey Hope. Hope hey. Hey hey Hope."
    "VAL-HALLAAAAA! I'M COMINGGGGGGGGGGGG!" (this was me charging to him)
  13. Ryan III

    Ryan III Well-Known Member

    Strange, Viking heaven is valhalla so why would he want to die. Always been a question to me.
  14. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    I think Overwatch is too powerful currently and will max stack 10 OW on anything that survives that long instantly.

    It also works just like Suppressive fire in that the duration is longer than the cooldown.

    Crits both slowing and stunning is too high for my taste as well. With overwatch and blood frenzy on (you don't need suppressive fire, just use any high RoF weaponlike SMG, Laser, Pulse or CB) and whatever is being attacked will never have a chance to move even 1 inch.

    In its current form, it deals much better DPS than just about any other team buffing skill or self buffing skill.

    How I think Overwatch would be balanced:
    Overwatch - Active: 25 energy cost, 30 second cooldown, 25 duration.

    Allied Heroic in 7 radius gain 10% damage bonus and 20% critical strike chance.
    Enemies suffering critical hits within 15 radius of the Assault have their ms and as slowed by 10% each, stacking up to 5 times with each stack lasting 5 seconds.

    This keeps the slowing effect but builds it up rather than giving it a flat reduction. It also slows AS in addition to MS. It keeps the critical strike stun fully within the Assault's hand and synergizes very well with his Blood Frenzy in that his chance of procing it is increased by 20% and give incentive to manage skills well to make full utility of having both the T3 and T2 active simultaneously.
  15. Emperor

    Emperor New Member

    It'd be nice if Overwatch used with Suppressive Fire granted a slow effect, and used with Blood Frenzy added OW. Although the latter is sort of counter intuitive since you'd want that OW for Queen. 25% Bonus to allied no matter what.

    Stun seems a little much in general. You can stun lock anything with 90% effectiveness with just Lvl 2 Crits and a Flamethrower or Laser with Blood Frenzy as it is. Upping the crit rate would put you at more or less 100% effectiveness with any high ROF weapon.
  16. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    On further thought, why would the Arms Assault buff allies and how is a "battle cry" going to make your allies that much better as a non-leadership class (looking at FO infantry T3 here for comparison)

    Using part of what Emperor said:
    Overwatch - Active: 25 energy cost, 30 second cooldown, 30 duration.

    Assault gains additional 25% damage bonus and 20% critical strike chance.
    Enemies suffering critical strikes by the Assault have their ms and as slowed by 10% each, stacking up to 5 times with each stack lasting 5 seconds while Suppressive Fire is active.

    The crit chance while active automatically makes Blood Frenzy better so the synergy already exists and needs no further mention.

    The T3 is on par on power with that of Rifleman's bloodlust (which does 50% as/dmg and -self armor) in buffing damage, crits, slowing and stunning without drawbacks and at triple the duration.
  17. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    It's a culture thing. Most Nords wanted (or want, considering the reconstructionist religion Asatru) to die in glorious combat so they could be recognized as fearless warriors and ascend to the kingdom of Valhalla. It's their version of heaven full of women, wine, and food, and basically you get to do nothing but dick around all day, fighting and killing each other. If you die in a fight, you literally respawn back in the chow hall so you can eat some mutton and then go fight and die again. It's actually, in my opinion, one of the better afterlife scenarios.

    I like this, actually. I was trying very hard to keep the original spirit of Overwatch, but the reasons that you've presented are sound.

    Plus, I like more crits. Crits crits crits. I like Critical Strike, or rather, improved Critical Strike ratios, being on the Arms Assault. Makes him have his own unique feel as opposed to "moar damage bonuses" like everyone else.

    I did make some changes though. The first one, which I don't think you'll have a problem with, is that I made the slow not stack. The reasoning for this is that the crit rate is so amazingly high at this point (30 from passive, 15 from Concentrated, 20 from Harvester leads to 65% crit rate) that 5 stacks will be achieved in no time. The editor doesn't actually like stacking debuffs all that much, and considering that the overall difference is going to be relatively negligible I'm just going to go ahead and avoid it altogether.

    I also boosted the damage. Yes, it's already better than Bloodlust, but you have to realize the context of the abilities. The Rifleman has (literally) twice the energy regeneration that the Rifleman does (comparing 0.5507 to 1.38). Hell, the Rifleman quite nearly has three times as much energy regeneration. The Rifleman is infinitely more sustainable than the Assault is, in addition to being much faster. Yes, the Rifleman takes much more damage, but I'd take an armor penalty and movespeed increase over being slow and semi-tough any day.
  18. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Fire Vulnerability, Heightened Senses. In the former case, it FAR outperforms Overwatch on DPS boosting, and it's a lower tier. Heightened Senses is a Tier 1 which is on par as far as DPS boosting and is a bit easier to infinitely maintain. So it's not exactly like the original that Kithrixx posted was the biggest DPS boost ever. Though the version I originally posted had a 10% bonus and applied to NPC units as well but was AoE limited and only applied over a target zone. You marked an Area on the ground and any enemy in that area (For the duration, if they left that area it wouldn't effect them, but if new enemies enter the area they would be effected).

    Not saying it wasn't Good. But it wasn't game breaking. Perception isn't a stat I often see used by people under about 80k. Only a few classes have critical hit chance boosting. One being an Assassination Marksman meaning he probably won't be firing that fast to really stack them on. So basically you're just talking about Arms Assaults and Combat Riflemen inflicting the crits. The innate chance marines have is... really low. What is it at, something like 5%? Even an OpsComm full Adrenaline stacked probably will be lucky to get 1 Crit during it.

    But I always liked the idea that should the team be paying attention early on to what people were building up they could go "Eh... I should grab Crit over Rapid Fire" or something in order to really take advantage of it.
  19. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    He did have a point, though. A teamwide boost of 25% as opposed to a personal boost of 25% is a hell of a lot more powerful. I do like the rework more, though, as the "team support" comes into play as the disable rate of the Arms Assault skyrockets as opposed to "hey everyone, deal more damage". It also fits the design more, because the Arms Assault in doesn't have any team-boosting abilities before that point, so why start there? The only team-boosting ability that the Assault actually has is Cohesion, and that's a T2 of the opposite tree.
  20. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Well, it reminds me of the discussion earlier where you had mentioned wanting to set the Assault apart from "MOAR DAKKA!" necessary from the other DPS trees. That was when the T3 discussion was being the merits of Overwatch over Peera's Total Annihilation. And particular trying to avoid it feeling necessarily like "Well why didn't you just (Better DPS Class)?" Like an Engineer who will dish out more damage along with the BHS effect to accomplish the same thing.

Share This Page