HMG Priority?

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Arcelia, May 7, 2012.

  1. Arcelia

    Arcelia New Member

    So a while ago i was an Ops Mando in a EC NM game and people didn't like the fact that i picked up the HMG that we found very early and they wanted me to give it to the Survival Rifleman.

    This has been bugging me for a while because I couldn't really see any reasoning behind it as i wasn't close to having T3 yet (found the HMG very early) so i wasn't over leveled or anything like that.

    I've always thought that we make the class that is good at something, better and more efficient at doing that task.
    Such as giving the armor to the tank, the arc to the energy intensive class etc.

    It makes sense to give the HMG to the Ops Mando because it makes it shoot better.

    Dont bring up the "Mandos should always be using Flamers the whole game" point because there are certain times where the flamethrower simply cannot be used better than a longer range weapon that has a large circular splash.

    So is there some secret reason for Survival Riflemen getting the priority over Ops Mandos that i dont know about, or is it just my unorthodox ways kicking in again? I hardly ever see Ops Mandos touch the HMG and it makes me sad. :(
  2. Thermidor

    Thermidor Well-Known Member

    IIRC it's the weapon proficiency skill of the roflman.
  3. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    There isn't. If you have an OpsComm he circumvents the Reload issue with Comboing after all. And his DPS is much higher.

    Simply: Your teammates were fools of the highest caliber. If your OpsComm is man enough to use it, give it to him. If he calls out "Want SMG", give it to him. Flamer? Give it to him. Basically anything short of Crowbar, if he's asking for it, should be a no-brainer to give it to him.
  4. Thermidor

    Thermidor Well-Known Member

    Ye. That's why I'm always thinking why does wep prof of the rofl still get higher priority than OpComm in some games?

    On another note, here's what I dug up from the wiki.
  5. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    Because people are retarded and having a DPS skill on a support class is retarded. It's going to be changed soon, I hope.
  6. Thermidor

    Thermidor Well-Known Member

    Good use of the word "retarded" there.

    On a serious note, agree that it's the wrong skill for the wrong theme of tree.
  7. Arcelia

    Arcelia New Member

    :mad:
    It only takes some practice to get the gold reloads during Adrenaline!!!
    Raaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaage
    :mad:
    Pointless Edit!!!: After seeing this, the Raaage part looked like Massage to me :p
  8. Ryan III

    Ryan III Well-Known Member

    Because a lot of people don't trust the Opcomm's ability to Reload remember I used exact color of the type of Reload they mean.
  9. SirGalahad

    SirGalahad New Member

    A large number of OpsComm players are not skilled enough to gold reload a HMG during Adrenaline (not a knock against them, I'm admittedly average at OpsComm). As a result, it becomes more efficient to give it to a Surv Rifle who can more easily pull it off, resulting in more consistent DPS. Additionally, as mentioned in the wiki, the Survival Rifleman will almost always be able to get a few of the Combat Tier1 skills, which will boost that consistent DPS even higher.

    Since the OpsComm can pretty much destroy mobs with any weapon, it's usually not a big deal to leave him with a Pistol/Flamer and an HK/M5 for range.

    Of course, in general, if your OpsComm (or any other class) is underleveled, give him whatever the hell gun he needs to kill stuff.
  10. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Well even if you can't catch perfect, it's still pretty damned good if you play it safe and aim for a 3-4 round reload (And if you're slow on the Koreanness, then hey, you got a Perfect Reload anyway!). Yeah, ideal if you get that 0 round reload every time. But it not like it completely destroys your DPS if you are hitting a 3 round reload instead.
  11. ArcanePariah
    • Development Team
    • Map Developer

    ArcanePariah Miracle Worker

    Agreed, but missing that reload on NM basically wastes the entire benefit on combo reloading, and basically tanks the opcomm dps.

    Simply put, OpComm is the most skilled based dpser in the NotD, but as a consequence, is EXTREMELY sensitive to any mistakes. Using HK/M5 mitigates screwing up, because the price is not nearly has high. Miss a combo reload with HMG and the dps your team was probably counting on just went out the window. Miss it on NM... and it will not be pretty usually, depending on the situation.

    It's certainly a case where there is great risk/reward, but that risk is entirely in the hands of the opcomm, and thus I would not trust any but the most skilled opcomms to employ such a weapon over trapper/arms assault/combat engie.
  12. MSluiter

    MSluiter Member

    It’s already been said, but commando can pistol/flame everything until domes. Then laser for queen.

    I think it’s more that giving the HMG to the rifle improves the dps of the team overall because the rifle can’t use the pistol/flame as efficiently as the commando can. Plus it helps him level. Survival rifle DPS improves alot as he reaches higher levels. Once commando maxes out the ops tree and gets 1 HS he is pretty much done with any DPS boost.
  13. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    Arms assault and operations commando both have ways of mitigating reloads just like surv rofl. If you have any dps class (opsmando, combat engy, smm, arms assault, or crofl) that wants the hmg, they have higher priority.
  14. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    You forgot to mention that the Opsmando, being the DPS monster that he is, can make much better use of the HMG than the Survrofl. In terms of numbers, the Opsmando will outdo the DPS of a Survrofl without trying. Surgical Strike's amazing damage bonus will completely outdo whatever the Survrofl will have available to him over a period of time, because that Surgical Strike damage comes when you need it and obliterates whatever you come in contact with. The piddly damage bonus and reload mitigation of Weapons Proficiency is vastly outdone by the Opsmando's Surgical Strike alone, not taking into account Adrenaline and/or Combo Reloads.

    The ability to mulch everything that he comes in contact with, bosses and hordes alike, makes him a prime candidate for the HMG, moreso than the Surv Rifle is now or ever will be. Considering that NOTD's hordes and bosses are in fixed positions in the storyline, Surgical Strike can be used to a much higher degree of effectiveness as opposed to a small bonus over a long period of time.
  15. Emperor

    Emperor New Member

    Well technically the first unwritten rule is to always give it to Emperor. If he's not in your game you can go down the list like so: (Good) OpsComm, Arms Assault, Combat Engi and Surv/Combat Rofl.
  16. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Exactly. You don't need to perfect reload Adrenaline-Surgical to make it work out into a monster for the OpsComm... though that is the ideal. A mere manual reload is more than enough to outshine any other class.
  17. SirGalahad

    SirGalahad New Member

    The issue isn't whether or not OpsComm can use HMG effectively though. Of course he can, he's the king of DPS after all. The major issue that I have with giving OpsComm first priority for the HMG is that he doesn't need it to destroy everything in sight. An OpsComm will have a much higher DPS at short range using a flamer (or pistol on single targets) vs using the HMG, and will still have lethally high, consistent DPS at long range using an HK or M5. Furthermore, in order for the OpsComm to make efficient use of the HMG, he must cycle through his actives constantly and at least blue combo reload. All this, combined with nuking, cutting, and dodging, is something that can only be done by really skilled OpsComms. A Surv Rifle, on the other hand, just sits there, presses C or G a few times when necessary, then presses T to reload.

    The damage ceiling of the OpsComm is second to none but, as ArcanePariah mentioned, the skill that goes into reaching that level is rare. That's why, unless you really trust your OpsComm, it's often easier to just give him a less risky weapon. If an OpsComm is busy nuking or just isn't skilled enough to manage his energy/tier1 cooldowns, his HMG DPS will be terrible.
  18. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    No, but it's the safest and most effective means of doing so because of the range that it has above those mentioned weapons, which is good because the commando is pretty squishy. It also allows the Commando to obliterate things before they get anywhere near the team, which is pretty damn important in Nightmare where enemies charge and you must give them a much wider berth to effectively kite them.
  19. Lightning
    • Donator

    Lightning Member

    just listen to wiki
  20. Lulz

    Lulz Well-Known Member

    as a ops mando for alot of the late night na nm games i feel i should throw my 2 cents in. For me i'll take HMG in alpha up to the second titan wave, after that im handing it off to another dps class, pistol has just as much damage potentiol on anything in alpha with zero risk, pistol my main weapon keep a flamer on the side. For ec i wont touch the hmg all game long. There is nothing in ec that a pistol or flamer cant handle just as well as an hmg, Pistol or flamer all the way to laser. bosses will drop faster than you can imagine.

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