HMG Discussion

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by ArcturusV, Apr 14, 2012.

  1. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    And thus I get it. A bit slow on my end.

    Also, I do hope you can get the HMG buffed. It's currently in a state where it's Okay, but not Great. Which is strange since it's such a limited spawn. It pains me to see kids who pass it up because it's not really seen as that much of an upgrade over the HK (Though I also think in part they are foolish fools of foolery for not appreciating it).
  2. Kith
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    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    It's appreciable, yes, and it does have larger splash/higher damage/no armor reduction, but the problem is that the reload is FOUR TIMES LONGER THAN THAT OF THE HK. I have Big Boss an ultimatum, it can use a damage boost up to 25 or even 30, or the reload can be cut down to 4.5 seconds. I don't care which, as long as it's fixed.
  3. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    This brings up a point to consider:

    Have it both ways?

    Create a LMG which has the current HMG stats (Maybe it has armor reduction of .5 or something as well to reflect the lower caliber?), but reload reduced towards 4.5 seconds. Then have a buffed damage HMG, still the same 6 second reload. Maybe give it an intrinsic Ammo Feed bonus to reflect that HMGs are typically belt fed, so it has double Magazine size standard.

    Just something to consider.
  4. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
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    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    If it's REALLY a heavy machine gun, it's something big enough it would normally be mounted to a vehicle, likely an APC or Tank. Yet the NOTD HMG does less damage than pistols and shotguns. If Anything it's some kind of Squad Automatic Weapon or at best a Medium Machinegun. It is in no way befitting of being called an "HMG" and definitely not a Chaingun.
  5. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    Unless you're a WWII US Marine. Plenty of stories about those hardcore bastards in the Pacific lugging around .50 cals they ripped off crashed planes and such, and one manning them Rambo style.
  6. Kith
    • Development Team
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    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    That's because marines are... unstable.

    Anyhow, yes, I've suggested LMG before, in addition to making HMG a quest reward item and giving it a massive buff in terms of damage and giving it a Recoil mechanic that made all but the heaviest classes (see: the assault and the technician) unable to fire it without being slowed like crazy.
  7. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    I said normally, I'm not taking into account crazy mother fuckers. But yes, that was "somewhat" a common occurrence in the pacific. When you combine grounded aircraft because of ruined airfields or enemy AA dominance, and marines who are outgunned and out-manned, creativity takes over.

    Anyways, taking into account 100 years of weapons manufacturing, and the fact the soldiers are in powered armor, also reduced "moon gravity" slugging around a weapon even the size of a Minigun for extended periods of time could be feasible.

    The fact still remains the HMG is underwhelming, if not underpowered. Its ONLY two assets are its splash, and its armor bypass. The armor bit is no longer the rarity it once was, with Pulse, Barr, Sting, L3, and even M45 all more or less being unaffected by armor.
  8. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    Other option is, if upping damage is somehow unacceptable you could give it some other bonus to at least give it a niche of it's own. Considering how withering amounts of high velocity rounds effect the sanity and aggression of most people I wouldn't mind something like:

    All units hit by the HMG are slowed 30% for 3 seconds.

    Least that gives it a bonus that can help make it stand out from other, easier DPS weapons of the same type like the Assault Rifle. Particularly with it's wide splash.

    Though I do support raising damage, possibly giving it a built in High Capacity Magazine effect (Which stacks with the High Capacity Magazine/Ammo Feed as well), as the primary and better option. Just throwing stuff out there in case you have some violent, core objection to it.
  9. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    Adding behaviors to weapons is considerably more work than just altering numbers.

    But, it's still not "hard" just time consuming. And no, it doesn't/shouldn't use much memory. It's infinitesimally smaller if done through the data editor.
  10. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    [split] Questions and Suggestions.

    Sadly the downside to me suggesting stuff. Knowing I have zero knack for programming of any sort, so not really sure what's easy or plausible.
  11. Thermidor

    Thermidor Well-Known Member

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    Err, I think you just posted in the wrong thread? This thread was just split then.
  12. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    RE: Questions and Suggestions.

    Victim of bad timing it seems.
  13. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

  14. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    [video=youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TclEDhbOmM&feature=related[/video]

    Or that as good inspiration.

    But yeah. Needs something. Not bad, just not great either. It's kinda sad when myself, as the Recon ends up using it mostly because no one else is man enough to grab it.
  15. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    As an orange-named item that's supposed to be one of the rarest guns in the game, it really needs to be more powerful to warrant its status.
  16. QuantumMech

    QuantumMech Well-Known Member

    I have to agree. I love the hmg to death, but it does lack. I like the idea of an lmg, and have it a rare-esque gun. If it is going to have the same stats as the hmg currently does, then I guess it still won't be appearing in recruit mode, though it could easily be like an arc, and spawn in chapter 3, and in the higher level games be a little more common than it currently is. If a new hmg is implemented, I like the idea of crazy move speed reduction in exchange for ridiculous damage. In other words, make it worth the amount of fuss I make over it.
  17. Blaqk
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    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Bugs, Pugs, and Scruggs

    Just give it a colossal weight of 50 or something. That way the movespeed loss is balanced out by class type. If you give it a flat ms penalty, then the poor Arms Assault is gonna be a turtle.
  18. ArcanePariah
    • Development Team
    • Map Developer

    ArcanePariah Miracle Worker

    Maybe I missed the original thread this was split from, but how is the HMG lacking? I'll ask around more today, but most vets or even remotely knowledgeable player know the HMG is pretty much the best gun in the game, only losing to Bar for single target damage. This is further reinforced by the fact that nearly every time I or any one else (regardless of class) is given the HMG, they WILL level hardcore, sometimes to the point they outlevel other DPS classes. Against many late game mobs (all stories), it is the most potent weapon for brinigng down Agrons/Devs/Slashers/Hulks/Immortals.

    We consider the flamer a powerful weapon, balanced by its moderate reload nad short range. The HMG has nearly all the best things about a flamer (large damage, awesome splash) with longer reload, but vastly longer range, and superior splash. For me its difficult to tell which one is more ammo efficient, since the HMG splash >>> Flamer for any large mobs, allowing opcomm to lay waste much faster at long range. Not to mention, HMG sucks vs nothing (Flamer is awful vs certain things, mostly mech related, which HMG happens to annihilate usually).
  19. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    I would suggest renaming the HMG to LMG with maybe slightly lowered stats, and then have an extremely powerful HMG with the only spawn as the 25% chance from seth. (weight 40 or 50, 30-35 damage, 10 second reload, has a built in hcm)
  20. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    It's not that the HMG is lacking per se... it's just that considering the rarity of the weapon it isn't quite as impressive as it should be.

    It's also somewhat telling that when Seth drops a HMG, most teams will piss and moan about it, in Apollo Security Team games they will usually demand that someone bite the bullet and buy a stinger from the Armory. It's a strange thing to think that one of the original power weapons is now seen as a booby prize. As well in typical Alpha Company and Apollo Security Team games, quite often my Recon ends up using the HMG merely because no one will touch it (Due to the prominence of other weapons in those modes). It tends not to have the same problem in Easy Company only because there are slightly less Power Weapon drops. And you include the Arms Assault who is pretty much destined to have the HMG.

    So the HMG kind of falls into this strange zone. It's good. But considering it's either a 1 per Storyline or 1 per Chapter drop (Apollo Only on that it seems), it doesn't reflect the same sort of power that other weapons of it's rarity does.

    The mere fact that you can see a HMG drop from Seth, and bitch that you just got gypped, and no one will even question that fact... We've all seen it before and I do think that's something which is quite telling as I said.

    Thinking about it again... the attack speed might also be one of the problems. The damage is high, but it's not that much higher due to being slowed down compared to other weapons in the rifle category. The Splash is good, sure. Though you did reference the Flamethrower. In general the Flamethrower's splash I find superior. Due to the simple nature of how the enemy approaches you, it's easier to arrange the zombies in a nice line than it is to get them to ball up. Just easier to use the Flamethrower Splash, and more damage, at a faster attack speed and a quicker reload.

    But the Flamethrower is the king of DPS, so I wouldn't rightly compare it.

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