Hits Calculation and Shields

Discussion in 'Archive' started by Ability, Apr 4, 2013.

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  1. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    The reason is because a hit is a hit. I personally would like to record how many times I've gotten hit, with or without shields, so I know how much I need to improve.

    The rating rework that I'm doing now will record shield hits but have drastically reduced penalties for getting hit in general. I'm pretty sure I've said this before, but the majority of the rating penalty focus will be shifting to dying rather than getting hit.
  2. VickHead
    • Donator

    VickHead Mercenary

    What about recording shield hits separately and not having shield hits affect rating? To me it seems kinda pointless as a pathfinder (right tree) to have 170 shield with 20 cp bonus and xs-4 armor and not to be able to jump broodlings to save people in surv without getting severely punished :( -20ish rating never letting my shield drop

    Or perhaps shield rating loss can be calculated in such a way similar to how a tank loses ratings from hits now? Almost non existent.
  3. vexxenon

    vexxenon Well-Known Member

    The 0 hit game with you being as assault, in ac nm, was it under the new shield hit system?
  4. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    You have 2second evasion. and while jumping all agroed zombies go attack others. I don't think your scenario makes sense. Jumping broodlings that aren't on you never gave hits.
  5. DrCaptain
    • Donator

    DrCaptain Well-Known Member

    Time to throw my hat into the Hit Calculation ring.
    I personally don't have a problem with the rating loss for shield hits. Yes, it suck, but that's only if you play like a dumbass. I agree with Kith about wanting to know how many times you've been hit, shield or no shield. A hit is indeed a hit. Obviously, for players under 10k xp, the penalty for shield hits should be significantly reduced or non-existent.

    This change might be difficult to play through and get used to, but people need to learn how to adapt. As a community, we have learned to adapt through significant changes before. One example is the reduction of the nuking range--instead of being able to sit at the fort and nuke everywhere on the map, people adapted and started running the EC domes inside Apollo itself. Another example is the addition of steps to the fort--people learned that the fort was no longer impenetrable, so they began arranging their formations accordingly. Or they would not use the fort at all.

    The point is that there have been significant changes to NOTD gameplay in the past and as a community through trial-and-error and creative thinking, people have adapted and found ways to overcome those changes. Why is this change any different?
  6. rockz
    • Donator

    rockz Well-Known Member

    It was added prematurely before updates to rating and not explained well in an announcement. Black ops also has a part to play in the negative reaction.
  7. vexxenon

    vexxenon Well-Known Member


    Wait, what? So don't jump broodlings that are raping your face tanking assaults? I'm at a lost here, please enlighten me.
  8. brizingr5

    brizingr5 Member

    He's say that between the 2 seconds of evation and the fact that they all die to one hit from jump, you shouldn't be getting hits from them.
  9. vexxenon

    vexxenon Well-Known Member

    Orly, you go play surv nm and tell me what something on paper makes sense, and doesn't work in real life.

    What you are assuming is yes broodlings dies from jump, but what you are forgetting is that more broodlings will rape your assault, at different rates (depends on bird atk distance and your face tank), what you'll end up doing is multiple jumps. And you better be timing those correctly because you can run out of them pretty quick if your facetank doesn't realize that he need to get back.

    So you're BO now? lol
  10. Arturia

    Arturia Well-Known Member

    It is a pity that someone gets punished because someone else isn't paying attention and is doing stupid things. Because your assault thought facetanking was a great idea, you end up having to deal with that burden, which ends with your rating getting raped.
  11. vexxenon

    vexxenon Well-Known Member


    I agree, when I play PF, I see myself as team's insurance. People will fuck up, such as facetanking broodlings, sy traps etc etc. My job as jump is to preserve their life and possibly MOH. Yes taking 0 hits as PF jumping at broodling can be done, and its possible on paper, but seldom does one achieve that with a reckless teammate in game. So you show me proof and I'll believe.

    What will probably happen is you ran out of jumps and your facetanker still tanks.
  12. brizingr5

    brizingr5 Member

    Even so, I don't see how the pf is taking hits if the assault is the one facetanking... If pf is taking hits, he's clearly the one facetanking.

    Yes, I am BO now, I'll take that as a congrats, to which I reply: Thank you.
  13. vexxenon

    vexxenon Well-Known Member

    I'll take the BO issue elsewhere, since that's not on topic.

    How about we play surv nm later tonight, I'll be the facetanker and you save me. And I'll record the hits that you took before and after. That is if you make it that far.

    We also had our nice little chat in NOTD channel, you can join a surv nm and play PF to prove your point, if not then you're argument is invalid. If you are unwilling to jump into sticky situation to save a teammate from dying, then you essentially already failed as PF.
  14. VickHead
    • Donator

    VickHead Mercenary

    It's not necessarily an assault facetanking that's the issue. It's people falling behind getting owned by broodlings in my example, and after the original broodlings are jumped more follow quickly. Guess I'll just go gunslinger and let the slow ppl die to save rating... there's teamwork for ya.

    Imo keeping people alive should be a high priority, now if i look at a situation and think "can i save him without getting hit? No? Then I guess he'll just die" You're saying if your team sticks together you should be able to handle it, but guess what, you can't control your team, you can't force them to stick together. You can't always be blessed with experienced people, there seem to be a lot of new players right now learning AC and surv.
  15. brizingr5

    brizingr5 Member

    After our conversation in the channel, I am convinced that Vex only disagrees based on the fact that he believes the people posting on here are not as qualified or have the same experience as he is, therefore he thinks we are wrong. Because of that, I'm just going to leave the argument as it is, because any further arguing of the point will not leading to any solutions of the game.
  16. VickHead
    • Donator

    VickHead Mercenary

    I don't see what this has to do with anything. I don't care about what bob thinks about jack, I'm offering up some suggestions and scenarios in which I believe are negatively impacted by the change without much foresight.
  17. Scorpione

    Scorpione Well-Known Member

    Ok this is pretty simple and basic. A jumper PF has the most survivability. You have 5jumps. Save always 1 jump. You can use jump to escape or jump into stuff n kill it. You have 2 second evade. 90% most of the time you take nothing. It even allows to dodge blindness. If you are alone you don't kill small zombies etc you actually play, click around them instead of being lazy and right clicking minimap and waiting to loose shields. You're fast and you have ability to dodge + evade hits from level 1. What exactly is the problem with it?
    On the other hand a guns pf is more vulnerable to hits than a jumper.
    Far as tanking lelas in surv. What's the point if u guys kite anyway? But anywhos, shouldn't tank or a fast firing class be behind the tank and shoot the broods down?
    Also haing tanked surv with both demo + assa and having tanked gotb itself I didn't have any problems the whole game. May I remind we dont kite(also we didn't have engi or tech to block path). You have charge to get away from broods you have look to buy you time to back out. Yes they can save u without getting especially since you have taunt. You're just making up anything and everything to try not have this system. Frankly it seems to me u just still have alot to learn about the game. Jumper wouldn't get hit. A SGer behind you wouldn't get hit. I don't see the problem. There's always a solution

    If anyone wants suggestion how to tackle specific things feel free to write a topic or pm me or anyone who's willing to help etc. Frankly I've had a massive amount of experience and different strats to tackle any mode.
  18. Extifer
    • Warden
    • Donator

    Extifer Stiffy is what Lyanden calls me.

    [​IMG]

    0 hits as PF while saving team from crap in NM apollo. In addition to Saving teams from mass banes and living.

    There's also this infamous moment that I did mostly because I was trying to fully understand the jump mechanics of path finder. I never actually died btw but actually lived and won that game.
    Show Spoiler

    [​IMG]


    Show Spoiler

    [​IMG]




    Might I also add that 0 hits in general is not really dependent on player skill solely. It is also dependent on your team composition and team as well. Also note, that I myself have received a few 0 hits game as path finder in survival NM a few times and this is not playing as a selfish player but someone who encourages team work.
  19. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    And that's with me working constantly, meaning I'm not up to practice like I used to be. In terms of playing frequency, I'm a casual player at best. All it takes is for people to use the right weapons and have proper team cohesion. If you're DPS heavy, coordinated focus fire will end all that ails you. If you're disable heavy, spread out the hard disables (the stuns and the gravity grenades) and make use of the soft disables whenever possible.
  20. brizingr5

    brizingr5 Member

    Vick, you were fine. You presented and issue and we simply replied to it. It was vex that was acting like our solutions were invalid due to our experience.
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