For QMech: Assault SMG vs. Shotgun on NM Erebos 2

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by David, Jul 12, 2012.

  1. David

    David Well-Known Member

    Played a EC NM EU run a few week back where I told Quantum Mech to use the SMG on Ereb2 versus the shotgun (as Arms Assault). He was rather reluctant so I told him I'd do the math and show him the difference:

    NM Erebos 2 Armor:


    12 - (10.8) - 7 = -5.8 armor (-17.8 from frenzy LD, AP, HBS)

    SMG Damage (24 base damage from mob classificaton bonuses):
    Combo (Concentrated Fire + Blood Frenzy + Harvester of Sorrow)
    ((24*1.3+(5.8*1.5))*1.75)+((24+1.3+(5.8*1.5))*0.6) = 93.77

    Combo - blood frenzy
    (24*1.3+(5.8*1.5))*1.75 = 69.83

    Shotgun Damage (40 base damage from mob classification bonus):
    Combo
    (((40*1.3+(5.8*1))*1.75)*2)+((40*1.3+(5.8*1))*0.6) = 236.98

    Combo - blood frenzy
    ((40*1.3+(5.8*1))*1.75)*2) = 202.3

    Considerations:
    -Max concentrated fire, crit, blood frenzy, harvester of sorrow and 1/2 extended clip
    -Reloads are based on manual reloads at 4 bullets left
    -Blood Frenzy oscillates 10 seconds on and 10 seconds off


    Results:

    [attachment=1326]
    Weapon comparison of damage done on NM Erebos 2 with an Arms Assault for 30s

    SMG damage : 26.2k
    M5 damage : 18.8k
    Pistol damage : 18.7k
    Flamer damage : 18.5k
    Crowbar damage: 16.9k
    Shotgun damage: 10.3k

    [attachment=1327]
    Weapon comparison of Stun(s)/s from bloodfrenzy

    Numbers > 1 stun second/s mean true perma stunned. Although, practically speaking any weapon able to stun erebos faster than his attack will have the same effect as perma stun (which is almost all of them).

    Discussion:

    Anyways, you (QMech) had mentioned you could have raped Erebos as badly if you were using a shotgun. The math says "no you couldn't have". If Erebos 2 were massive, which he is not, this would roughly translate to a x2 factor in the damage seen above. This massive factor is the reason the shotgun is so devestating against most bosses and agrons. Oddly enough, true shotgun damage isn't static as the crit numbers would suggest. I tested out full combo shotgun on Meno and did from ~330-550 damage a shot with the average falling where the math would suggest it should, if it were static.
  2. Pyromaniac

    Pyromaniac Well-Known Member

    Did you calculate that Erebos is Light? Shotgun does have a bonus for that.

    Theoretically (and from what Kith has said in various places) if that Marine had 3 fmj's, the shotgun apparently does some mean damage which I could believe topping the smg.

    NotD is not where I try to do math however
  3. QuantumMech

    QuantumMech Well-Known Member

    Shotty should be doing 75 per whatever it shoots to ere. Or something like that, I would have to look. And are both of those graphs using covering fire (or whatever it is called now)?
  4. David

    David Well-Known Member

    @Pyro, light classification has been accounted for, hence the 40 damage instead of 35. Despite what Kith said (I was in that game) the damage calculation for a single target follow very rigid calculations. I believe what Kith was referring to was overall damage to the area increases with fmj use, but shouldn't effect the target mob. I'll buy some fmj and see if the crit numbers change, I doubt they will.

    @Qmech, the shotgun doesn't do 75 damage per shot (unfortunately) because Erebos is NOT massive. And yes my calculations take concentrated fire into account (including the the 15 percent crit increase hence the 75% total crit modifier seen as 1.75 in the damage calc.
  5. Kith
    • Development Team
    • Designer

    Kith NOTD Staff: Anti-Fun Wizard Skeleton

    The crit numbers change based on damage dealt. If you're doing a Biffgun, the crit numbers are going to stack. The way to figure the damage is by watching how much damage you do per shot vs. said boss. Nite's tested it and so have I, and it's somewhere in the ballpark of 500 damage a pop if you position yourself correctly. HOWEVER, this was some time ago (I have long stopped doing Biffgun shenanigans because it's pretty fucking stupid) and Ability may or may not have ninja patched it.

    The reason that the Shotgun is good vs. Ere is because the Shotgun stuns him. The DPS is somewhat lacking (one of the few times that it lacks vs. anything, really), but the ministun is (at least in my opinion) totally worth it.
  6. QuantumMech

    QuantumMech Well-Known Member

    Why is ere not massive. This is freaking bs. I demand a recount. :mad:
  7. MSluiter

    MSluiter Member

    Let's all just recognize that the SMG is a bad ass gun IF you use it vs the right type of enemies. It's had a bad rap for way too long.
  8. Pyromaniac

    Pyromaniac Well-Known Member

    @Quant, hard to be a light unit and massive. The point of using snipers on erebos is because he is light, and not massive (in general terms)

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