Apollo Security Team Discussion

Discussion in 'NOTD Discussion' started by Reaper, Feb 17, 2012.

  1. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Well, ideally the way it would be is "If you shoot it down... good, here's your XP reward for the mission!" If you don't it's "Oh shit, Koller has to shoot it down like the ruthless bastard he is!"

    As far as the civilians inside? Not the same group as the Easy Company civilians. The way the timeline would work is:

    Apollo Security Team shoots them down. Passengers die/are infested.

    Alpha Company finds civilians in Nakagawa Bay and bring them to the Delta Transport.

    Easy Company finds the survivors brought by Alpha Company earlier and leads them to the truck.

    Though that was my original thought if I remember Priyanka was already in the Delta Transport during Alpha Company. So maybe that's bust.
  2. Reaper

    Reaper Moderator/The Crimsonrine

    Haha, not alot of peeps know about those civs. The mission for them is broken anyway and they take forever to get where they are supposed to be.

    I like the idea of shooting down a transport, oh how well it can be put in.
    Player: A colonist ship is leaving the colony, several families on board. I hope they make it to...
    Lt Sheng: Repeat that last.
    Player: A colonist ship is leaving the colony and the...
    Lt Sheng: Shoot it down!
    Player: What? But...
    Lt Sheng: Our orders are to stop this infestation from spreading...
    Player: Yes but sir...
    Player: Sir, scans indicate their clean, there is no infes...
    Lt Sheng: I say who is clean, and who is not. Your orders are to shoot down that transport and kill anyone you find left alive at the crash site. We kill them all.

    By this point we think Lt Sheng has gone completely insane. He saw thousands of people be butchered, had his best friend turned into a colossal angry infested marine, lost several men and everything is going to ruin around him so we can only guess that all what has happened has taken its toll on the good Sheng. But all just a ruse by the clever Black Ops Operator...

    The mood of the Apollo Security Team can be an evil one where players "save" Apollo by killing everyone. In the beginning of the game it is simply try and save and truly save Apollo but as it goes on it plunges into chaos and utter madness. The kind of mission where some would feel uneasy about what they have to do. You know that feeling when you see a cute virtual computer generated animal or a person is begging for mercy but they are killed before your eyes and you feel uneasy. You know its not real, you know a real living thing didn't die but still. The Apollo Security Team turn out to be worse monsters than what they were fighting.
  3. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Yeah. I know what you mean. Just came out of a "Destroy Apollo" game where my team decided to leave me as the only one moving towards the reactor (Everyone else moved as a team to Comms which I didn't expect). I ended up standing right in their way. Had to have knifed down about 80 civilians while I was Pistol Whipping the Infested, my Reaper chiming in with the big 12 mm just constantly killing everything in sight. While I waited for my teammates to catch back up.

    Course we have a similar moment now in the Armory Holdout, with the random civilians coming for you and the players go "Fuck it, kill them all!!!!! *crazy eyes*" So it's not like those moments don't exist already.

    And I know the civilians you were talking about. i was thinking Team B was the runners.... I knew there was some random NPCs who get sliced to ribbons by Dome B within about the first 20 seconds. So I was pondering if there was some civilian thing at Dome B that I somehow missed.
  4. Reaper

    Reaper Moderator/The Crimsonrine

    The current colonists are all mixed in with infested so one can kind of assume they just have to turn eventually. I say that every colonist you see running at you during a horde wave of zombies is infested.

    I remember a Path A game where everyone was shooting the crap out of the waves and a few colonists made it through and herded around a few players, I came in from the side and started to hack and slash like a 90's horror movie.
    Player: Reaper, what are you doing?
    Me: What do you mean?
    Player: Your killing colonists
    Me: They are infested
    Player: How do you know?
    Me: I don't

    What I'd like to see is colonists who are 100% clean and no zombies mixed in with them. You have the choice of silently saving them, lying to Sheng and say that they have been taken "care of" or you can just go about selecting Attack and moving your mouse cursor over a colonist, left click and the screams start... drowned out by the sound of gunfire.
  5. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member


    Excited to see my suggestion about the Deimos fight was listened to and implemented in some form. However missed one key point I consider important for Balance reasons:

    Deimos needs his egg spam reduced.

    Since this is a much more open fight we can't funnel his minions. Having this 12 minion spam just makes the fight a total crapshoot. Depends too much if the team found weapons like the L3 or Stinger before Armory. Or Demo Satchels. But I wouldn't consider that a good solution since the Demo is slated for replacement.

    I didn't get far enough to see if he did any of the other stuff besides disable the IVAX. But I presume he does since everyone was shouting "We gotta save the devastators!!!" after the Armory waves.

    So yeah. Just the only concern. Reduce the Egg Spam, or perhaps make the eggs a little more vulnerable than they currently are (Seem to be about 300 HP).
  6. Nicarco
    • Warden
    • Donator

    Nicarco Warden

    I believe Deimos does one of three things:

    Goes to the brutalisk area and releases about 6 titans
    Disables the IVAX unit
    Destroys all the devastators

    I think the main problem with intercepting him is that it involves traveling half way across the map at best (since you have to start from the armory) so you either travel during the armory holdout, which is quite hard, or run really fast as soon as Deimos appears.
  7. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Well, when i did it he went for IVAX each time.

    I can say that from the end of the Hordes, and making my best time with a SurvCon (So not like I have Shadowstep boosts or anything), I was able to reach IVAX at nearly the same time Deimos did (He spawned near Easy Company's start each time). The only thing keeping me from stopping Deimos necessarily was my team was just so unprepared for it and didn't haul ass.
  8. Ramses II
    • Donator

    Ramses II Help, I can't change my title!

    We've started camping the center square and having the smm start the armory and shadowstep to us. We then move to engage Deimos from there.
  9. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Played a 1800sr nm secA just now - my first successful sec in maybe 1.5 months. Played Rifleman.

    Deimos seems a lot easier than before now for some reason. People just use pulse/smg with designator and someone optionally with stinger and he just falls flat fairly quick. He barely got to even spawn eggs or feed on them.
    Maybe it is also because we fought him out in the open instead of camping at fort like the olden days.

    Nazara was pretty difficult and maybe the hardest boss of the bunch. ADC bots are still insane but well controlled with Rifleman traps.

    HAL was very difficult. We lost quite a few people there. Repulse stunning 1 HAL stream maybe with 50% success for 2 seconds a time was a lifesaver. Inception probably would have helped too if Psi Ops was alive still. We barely managed HAL. Again, challenging for NM.

    After that it just went downhill in terms of difficulty - although admittely only 4 alive at this stage. Repulse was extremely effective in general keeping mobs at bay.
    Apoptosis even without prep only the tech got bleed and tanked it while I spammed repulse to keep it passive. Fight was over in seconds.

    After that, reactor sequence was a tad challenging though maybe a few more delayed spawns would have been nice. After the meltdown, some extra mobs would add challenge too to keep team together as well as evade Heph. In fact we never saw Heph by the time we reached the Evac. I feel maybe there should be some sort of obstacle at EC to prevent players just running through that easily. That lone turret was evaded without problems. Huggers we didn't see as we reached exit at around 2:36 remaining.

    Route B on the other hand was a lot more difficult especially at Athena. Route A while less rewarding and shorter simply seemed to have no difficulty at all after HAL. Maybe it is difficult if you delay running to EC after the meltdown, but we didn't.

    Outside of HAL, people tended to die mostly early to banelings, roaming creeps or Nazara. Creeps and Banes weren't an issue once people got past around level 6/7.
  10. Reaper

    Reaper Moderator/The Crimsonrine

    That entire post was just through the eyes of a Survival Rifleman. Repulse in nearly every sentence. :p

    Why Deimos went down fast was because he was caught on 2 sides keeping him centered, the utmost easiest boss kill tactic and good use of the Stinger whacked all the eggs he spawned. Maybe Deimos should get a Burrow Strike ability to pop up amongst players in Nightmare games and then lay an egg field as he comes up.

    Nazara went to hell because of our dear rampaging Technicians. :s

    Be glad though you didn't see Hephaestus but at the moment he is easily avoided, needs something to make him more threatening in Nightmare Mode games.

    Path A is definitely alot easier than Path B and needs something to make it challenging.

    What I would like to see is more colonists spawning, remain neutral and start attacking players with Molotovs round the time you have to blow the Reactor.
    Colonist: Your going to kill us all! DIE WITH US!

    In the start also more colonists during the opening Armory wave but colonists that come into contact with players convert to friendlies and can then be escorted to a place for evacuation. Apollo Security Team still needs its colonist rescue mission/s.
  11. Ghost
    • Warden

    Ghost Warden

    Well no, in our first attempt even with 2 MotM techs most died to Naz due to ADC bots and getting focus fired down by Naz as we were shooting the clone.
    On the second I spent 15 mins trapping Apollo :D

    As for Deimos as far as I could tell we were all on the right side facing fort and he was at north alley clearing as he was inching towards me and shooting me constantly.
  12. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    Ok so I just did a NM apollo B on a 1900+ sr. I figure thats an adequate test ground for Chem.

    1: Chems base movespeed is too low. It needs to be about 0.15 higher, shave of 30 hp for balance if necessary.
    2: The casting range on Inbound sickness must be greatly increased. It needs to be at least 12. Also increase the acceleration on the rocket.
    3: Massive lag during Hades. That smoke cloud when he dies is atrocious. Also, way too many black holes.
  13. Lord NiteShade
    • Wiki Founder
    • Community Leader

    Lord NiteShade NOTD Staff: Wiki Founder/TeamSpeak Admin

    More chem nuisances.
    1: Venoms will heal Athena, rapidly.
    2: Contaminate cannot hurt structures (at least infestor eggs and creep tumors).
    3: Units killed by venom (not chems skill, the venom ailment itself), will not spawn "death units."
    Ie, Devourers don't spawn banes, and infestors/agrons don't spawn larva.
    4: Chem still using Killteam marauder portrait.
    5: 10 cp spawn quote is still Marauder's line.
    6: Chem's model is still incorrect model tint.

    Also, Olgivy/Ivan should be immune to venom. They're idiots, and love to walk into contaminate fields. Since venom lasts a looooong time, Olgi/Ivan could conceivably get enough venom to hinder their regen or slow them enough to be dead weight.
  14. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Ops

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Operations and Web

    Just spent the past 30-45 minutes kiting Athena around Apollo. With a HUGE amount of luck I managed to kill her. The luck stems from the fact that she has that damned stun. Why does she have that? It's a very long duration stun that she can perform on anyone she has vision of, shared or otherwise. That stun encourages camping. Get rid of it. When she's properly camped, she'll never be able to use it because she'll never get vision. If you try to kite her like a good boy, she'll just stun you and let the devourers rape you. I have other grievances with Apollo Sec Team which I will post once I finish soloing the damn thing.
  15. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Ops

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Operations and Web

    Here it is. This is a 2 hour replay of me soloing Apollo Sec Team Route B as a Psi Ops. Ignore the careless SoT that nearly gets me killed during Deimos.

    Apoptosis needs a new gimmick. I don't know of anyone who likes the Apoptosis mechanic or even thinks it's a good one. The idea of someone being forced to take hits, get hurt, and risk their lives is the opposite of survival. NOTD stops being a survival game when Apop makes the scene. The bosses in Apollo Sec Team make me think more of an arcade game than a survival anything.

    Athena needs to lose the stun. Period. See my previous post as to why. Better yet, just watch the damn replay. The whole first half of the fight is a crapshoot of whether or not her next stun is going to kill me. By the time I get Mental Projections to counter the stun, she randomly decides not to do it anymore.

    Hades 1 needs to do something. He's currently just a big troll. If you have the patience to watch it until the end, the only damage I and my Devastator take is from me not realizing that green splooge hurts Devastators too, and then me getting trolled by a ninja black hole on the airlock wall.

    Hades 2 and Nazara are fine as they are.

    Back to Alpha Company I go. So far it's the only storyline that I can't solo. =\


    Oh, and add some scaling to the Athena waves. Did you see that crap?
  16. Reaper

    Reaper Moderator/The Crimsonrine

    Arcade games do have the best boss fights in gaming history. Metal Slug got loads of them and is straight A.

    I like Apoptosis. Sacrifice some of your own life to end his. Fair trade.

    Speaking of Hades 1, what happens in a normal Sec Team? Also he is only 60%-80% complete. (So I hope)
  17. Blaqk
    • Development Team
    • Webmaster/Ops

    Blaqk NOTD Staff: Operations and Web

    Hades 1 in a normal Sec Team B is no different than what I did. Just stand around shooting him. If a black hole pops up under you, scoot over.
  18. Reaper

    Reaper Moderator/The Crimsonrine

    No numerous Ghoul or Seeker spawns?

    And I remember that I found a Hades clone fight in a very similar game.

  19. ArcturusV

    ArcturusV New Member

    Heh. Maybe, but Arcades have decent boss fights, but not Memorable ones. When I ask people about the boss fights they vividly remember it tends to be console games. For example, "Iron Mike", "The Dynamite Kid", Mike Tyson on Mike Tyson's Punch-Out.

    You know, back before he smacked his wife.

    As for Apoptosis, I don't like him either. I touched on it during my huge post about a re-imagining of the storyline. Apop is a bad fight for two reasons: A) It encourages you to do something you shouldn't do in any other situation. B) It makes the Boss Fight into a true Solo Show.

    I mean you might say something like Eos is all about the Protection Assault and the other teammates are basically just mere DPS but you don't "Need" them. But you do need them to help curtail the hordes, control shriek stuns, make sure the Infested Marines don't venom him out, etc.

    But Apop it's just... nothing. Other teammates are pointless. And in fact kinda hurt your ability to control aggro on him.
  20. Reaper

    Reaper Moderator/The Crimsonrine

    The thing I do like most about Apoptosis is that he is the exact opposite of what you normally should be doing, not getting hit and not getting ailments. Someone has to go out there and take one for the team. And in all fairness that someone should be Butters...

    Perhaps... We can keep Apoptosis and introduce an alternative as well?

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